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The Difference Between ADHD Coaching and Therapy - 066

adhd executive function podcast Nov 16, 2019

Hey ADDers!  So glad you could join me for today’s episode about ADHD Coaching and Therapy – Differences and Similarities.  Before I talk about the similarities and differences, I’d like to take you on a little journey.

ADHD that is diagnosed in adulthood doesn’t travel alone; rather it often comes with “companion challenges” such as depression, anxiety, addictions, trauma and even illnesses.  Sometimes these “companion challenges” are there as a result of this later in life diagnosis and sometimes not.

In this episode Dr B talks about:

  • Later in life diagnosis of adult ADHD and what to do next
  • Adults learning essential executive function skills later in life
  • Embracing structure and cycles in all areas of your life
  • The importance of celebrating your WINS
  • Three Steps You Can Take to Start Getting Organized - The Fun Way!:  Free 1-Hour Live Webinar Sunday, November 17, 2019 at 5 pm Pacific time.  Event is over.
  • Learn about Masterclasses on Decision-Making, Time Management and Procrastination! 

The driving force behind this show, the ADDventures programs:  AIA Foundational Skills and AIA Next Level, and all my social media is to end the needless pain and suffering of those with ADHD and/or under-developed Executive Function Skills.

Developing your Executive Function Skills and shifting your limiting beliefs is the fastest and most effective way to overcome ADHD limitations, find focus, gain confidence, and newfound freedom in your life!

My mission is to put an end to the worldwide needless suffering of adults with ADHD and those with under-developed Executive Function Skills - whether from ADHD, chronic depression or anxiety, trauma, addictions, or chronic illnesses.  And, you don't need a formal diagnosis to know you need help developing these executive function skills in order to greatly reduce your suffering.



Full Episode Transcript Today is Episode 66 with Dr B

Hey ADDers! So glad you could join me for today’s episode about ADHD Coaching and Therapy – Differences and Similarities. Before I talk about the similarities and differences, I’d like to take you on a little journey.

ADHD that is diagnosed in adulthood doesn’t travel alone; rather it often comes with “companion challenges” such as depression, anxiety, addictions, trauma and even illnesses. Sometimes these “companion challenges” are there as a result of this later in life diagnosis and sometimes not.

Think about it, if ADHD isn’t diagnosed until later in life, it is understandable that someone would be suffering with depression because of all the losses they have experienced due at least in part to their undiagnosed ADHD or with anxiety because they are nervous about being able to perform as expected in typical adult life situations such as getting a job, holding a job, doing well in that job, getting married and raising a family without falling apart in the process, doing well in academia to complete a college degree, or become so stressed from living with an undiagnosed or unidentified condition that they become traumatized throughout the course of their life.

If this is how it’s gone for you, and you have ended up feeling hopeless or helpless or carrying around a ton of shame about how your life has been unfolding up to now, especially when you know you are a bright person and feel you are capable of so much more than you’ve been able to manifest thus far - I get it; I do.

And there’s something else I want to touch on because it’s important to know. Years ago I recorded a video and wrote an e-book about The Elephant in the Room. It's that “elephant” that I want to touch on here. Based on my ongoing research, I found that there is no academic requirement in any state in the US to learn about adult ADHD or executive functions, and that there is no requirement to have this training and knowledge in order to sit for licensure and become a licensed mental health professional.

So, what does this mean? To me it means that if I go to see a mental health professional, and they lack the training to recognize that I am an adult with ADHD and executive function challenges, I am in trouble. I can tell them about all of my experiences and symptoms and those symptoms will most likely get attributed to something else, such as depression or anxiety because my adult ADHD and specifically my under-developed executive function skills is invisible to them. Have you had a similar experience?

Does this mean that no mental health professional has this training – absolutely not! Many have sought separate, specialized training in adult ADHD so they can recognize, diagnose and treat adults with ADHD along with the “companion conditions” that exist. That’s what I did over 30 years ago as a therapist, and then specialty training in ADHD coaching after that.

How do you know who does or doesn’t have this specialized training? You have to ask a lot of questions, like those I’ve included in the eBook that goes with the “elephant” video. I’ve included the link in the show notes if you’re interested in getting a copy of this information including the questions.

Over the years, I’ve known mental health professionals who felt they could “treat” anything. Seriously?! How could they work effectively with a marital couple that was having challenges due to adult ADHD or under-developed executive function skills if they don’t understand what potential impact this has on someone’s marriage? Or work with an adult who is having challenges at work due to ADHD or executive functioning yet confuse that with them being depressed and not performing for that reason. Or work with an adult in college who isn’t getting the work done or getting to classes as they need to and attribute it to they just aren’t motivated enough – because if they were, they would step up and take responsibility. Again…seriously?!

In my first semester in college I had a professor who called me into his office to tell me that I just wasn’t trying hard enough in his history course and that if I put in more time and effort I would do much better. At that time I was spending most of my time on his course material and only clearing a D in the course. I thought, “How dare he say that when he knew nothing about how hard I was working to pass his course.” And I remember some of the challenges were things like the font size and type for the course textbook, the glossy white paper that contrasted with the small, difficult to read font, and the burlap like texture of the cover on the textbook. All of those sensory experiences came together to make it very difficult to read the book and it didn’t help that his lectures weren’t engaging or stimulating for me.

I could just as easily cite work environments that weren’t conducive to being able to focus well enough to get the work done due to the layout of the space and the tons of distractions that would come into my visual field. Or the sensitivity to the sounds of students’ restlessness during test taking time that prompted me to require permission to sit outside in the hallway on the floor to put a physical wall between myself, and the free floating anxiety in the classroom, so I could focus on what I knew and perform at that level.

And even though I haven’t raised a family, I have worked with many adults who are raising kids and without the executive function skills necessary; the task is more stressful that it needs to be. You might not remember to follow through on the consequences you set with your kids because of an under-developed working memory or have the skills to create efficient schedules, routines, structures focus and follow through on what’s most important, when it’s most important. That means that a lot of things can go sideways in parenting experience. And what you want more than anything is to be a good parent to your kids.

If any of this is part of your story, I understand your frustration – I do.

ADHD therapy is definitely important when there are psychological issues that need to be healed, and if the mental health professional has the proper training, it can be a lifesaver. So please, seek the therapy you need, if that’s your situation, and be sure to ask lots of questions to know that the person you intend to work with has the training to truly help you.

And, if you’re in therapy working on healing the issues to your ADHD, depression, anxiety and whatever else but you still aren’t making the progress in critical areas of your life that you need to, such as paying your bills on time or making sure that you stay on task and follow through for yourself and your kids (if you’re a parent), ADHD coaching can be a wonderful compliment to your therapy.

If you’re like many adults with ADHD and under-developed executive function life skills, you may never have heard of ADHD Coaching. Many adults I speak with are just now discovering this type of coaching and had never known about it before. None of the professionals they have worked with even mentioned it, and yet ADHD coaching has been around for over 20 years.

You may have thought that after seeing someone for a diagnosis (if that’s what you did) and then perhaps saw a doctor for medication, (if that’s what you decided to do), then maybe worked with a therapist to move beyond all the issues that your ADHD and “companion issues” caused in your life, that your life would be so much better. And when it wasn’t, you might have blamed yourself and thought that you must not be doing the work that everyone has told you to do because you aren’t getting the results.

That couldn’t be farther from the truth. Psychological treatments, sometimes called ‘psychotherapy’ or talk therapy’ involve talking about your thoughts to better understand your own thinking and behavior as well as understand and resolve your problems. And yet many who seek therapy for their ADHD don’t resolve their problems in the way they need to be resolved because they are not learning what is missing and then taking action on what will make the difference.

This is where ADHD coaching comes in. It is a collaborative, supportive, goal-oriented process in which the coach and client work together to identify the client’s goals and then develop the self-awareness, systems, skills and strategies necessary for the client to achieve those goals and fulfill their potential, all the while developing whatever is under-developed in terms of executive function life skills.

We often hear the phrase “treatment for ADHD” in adults which typically translates to medication and therapy. These are considered “treatments.” Coaching is not a “treatment” for ADHD. However, it is definitely a methodology that compliments therapy and just like a sports coach helps aspiring athletes to up their game and achieve better results, so it is with an ADHD coach and the adult skills you need to be proficient in to live a less stressful and more fulfilling life.

I’ve been asked many times what is the difference between coaching and therapy. I’d like to start with the similarities and then move to the differences.

A therapist and a coach both establish a helping relationship with a client, with the general goal of helping their client to grow and to live a better life. A client goes to the therapist with goals they want to achieve, whether emotional, cognitive or behavioral goals, and painful issues they want to heal and resolve. A client goes to a coach with goals that they want to achieve or life style changes they want to make and performance related issues. And specifically with ADHD coaching, the focus would be on the development of necessary skills while also engaging the strengths of the client to support their growth. In both cases, the working relationship needs to be supportive and respectful of the client’s needs as well as free of judgment, manipulation or abuse. Both therapist and coach are there to meet the needs of the client, not their own needs. Confidentiality and trust are part of both coaching and therapeutic relationships. Both therapists and coaches get to know their clients over time; however, some therapists and coaches want to get to know as much as they can about their clients upfront before their work together commences and have a methodology to accomplish that initial goal. Whether working with a therapist, coach or both, the client needs to be open to change and willing to make changes in line with his or her stated goals. The inability to be open and engage could be interpreted by the therapist as resistance in the psychotherapeutic process; whereas the coach might interpret it as an absence of the skills necessary to engage and look for missing pre-skills that need to be developed before the client is ready to engage in the work they came for.

Both coaching and therapy work with beliefs and feelings to some degree, but at very different levels of processing. It is typical for a therapist to help a client work through very painful feelings, underlying core issues and negative or self-defeating beliefs and behaviors. A coach does not get involved in these deeper emotional, cognitive or behaviors issues as they are not “treating” a cause or condition such as depression, anxiety, addictions, etc. The coach must refer the client to a therapist to address these issues. The level of feelings that a coach addresses may involve frustrations, fears of failure or success, avoidance behaviors, loss of confidence and even lack of self-trust. More specific to ADHD coaching would be the procrastination that comes when the client doesn’t know where to start or how to start and seems to lack the ability to figure this out. With great questions, the seasoned coach can help the client break down the process so it becomes doable for the client. There are certainly therapeutic benefits to coaching as there are with therapy, even though the intent is not to provide therapy as a coach.

That leads me into some importance differences between therapy and coaching. Therapy by its very nature is a mode of “treatment.” When we are referring to ADHD, we are talking about treatment as it fits with the DSM-V diagnostic criteria for adult ADHD. Please be aware that there is no diagnostic code for adult ADHD; just the code for teens and children with adult examples. Treatment involves the application of therapeutic modalities or techniques and remedies to relieve problems that are related to disorders in the DSM-V. Therapy looks at what is wrong within the person and what needs to be treated or fixed. This is an illness-based or disordered model, not a wellness model as in coaching. To provide therapy, the professional must be licensed in their state or working under the license of another professional. After obtaining one’s therapist education, the mental health professional is required to intern under a licensed person to help shape their therapist skills for a number of hours, such as 3000 hours for a licensed marriage, family therapist in the State of CA. Then there is the licensing exam after obtaining intern hours. It is a very stringent process, even though as I mentioned in the beginning there is no requirement for academic or licensure working knowledge of adult ADHD or executive function. It often feels like the therapist profession is focused on what’s wrong with the person not what’s right, and worse, views the person as someone in need of fixing. Even though we refer to the field as the mental health field, there doesn’t seem to be much health in the field. Rather it seems to function more like a mental illness not mental wellness field.

Coaching is based more on a “wellness” model and intends to improve daily functioning and wellbeing for individuals who don’t have significant psychological impairments. That places coaching more in the realm of an educational process as opposed to a treatment process. Think of a sports coach. They assess the qualities of their players and help them to up their game and get to the top, if that’s their goal. There are specialized ADHD coaching programs now that are accredited through the bigger coaching organizations and more specific requirements to be a certified coach have emerged, which is a good thing. Previously, anyone could call himself or herself a coach, even without the specialized training.

Coaching is more flexible than therapy in some ways. Much of the work may be done over the phone or on live stream video, since the emotional component of therapy that typically requires in-person meetings is not an issue with coaching. A coach in California may work with a client in New York and never meet in person, yet the coaching can be very effective. A coach is able to take a more holistic approach that takes into consideration any issue which effects daily living such as productivity, the work and home environment, diet, exercise programs, managing time, basic financial management (are the bills getting paid?), sleep, and so much more.

A very practical consideration for many people is that therapy is covered by health insurance, whereas coaching is not. Again, think of a sports coach and how that would not be covered by health insurance.

Lastly, a therapist is allowed to coach as a modality of treatment for their client when they are providing “treatment” for psychological conditions that fall under their license, so long as they are appropriately trained to coach their client. A coach is not allowed to do therapy, since they are not a licensed mental health professional that provides “treatment.”

Recapping here:

· ADHD therapy work is about healing from the psychological wounds that occur throughout your lifetime in connection with adult ADHD as its “companion conditions” such as depression, anxiety, addictions, trauma and more.

· ADHD coaching work is about helping adults with ADHD strengthen their executive function, improve their quality of life, and achieve their self-identified goals, and addressing the pragmatic issues of achieving them while living with ADHD or under-developed executive function skills.

o Life coaching – bigger picture issues for quality of life

o Skills coaching – developing life skills that are weaker

o Education – providing information about current research

· Drilling down into more specific details of what you might work on with ADHD coaching:

o Focusing on work priorities and productivity

o Being held accountable for stuff they want to accomplish

o Clearing all kinds of clutter – paper, digital, and stuff

o Using time wisely and getting things done

o Planning and finishing projects – what a concept

o Finishing a gigantic project

o Building simpler, smarter habits and routines

o Getting the important things done

o Tons of time management skills – using a calendar, planner, task list, reminders, apps, etc.

o Understanding what’s ADHD and what isn’t

o Setting and reach goals

o Getting places on time

o Studying and homework skills

o Being a more patient and consistent parent

o Being a more supportive spouse or partner

o Building better diet, sleep and exercise habits

o Improving relationship and communication skills

o Knowing what to say to other people about your ADHD

Bottom-line, ADHD therapy and ADHD coaching work well together to serve your bigger picture needs.

Today’s episode is about understanding more about ADHD coaching and therapy and getting whatever you need to heal from painful wounds as well as develop the skills to make a radical difference in the quality of your life. You can do this!

Remember that you are NOT what you do or don’t do; that you are more than that. You are not any of the stories you make up about yourself. YOU are NOT defective or less than as a person – as a human being - because of being organized or disorganized. Remind yourself that your mind just works differently and that difference is actually pretty cool once you have a new perspective and the tools you need for your own success.

AND – Knowing is only the first step. It’s said that “knowledge is power” and it is so long as you take action on that knowledge. Otherwise, you could end up walking around knowing everything you need to do and doing nothing. So take action and either get the results you were seeking or get a lesson, which then allows you to fine tune your actions and go again so you get more results or another lesson. We are all a work in progress, so please don’t let yourself off the hook here by taking action once, not getting the results you hoped for, and stopping there. Seriously!! Did you learn to walk well the first time you stood up? I know I didn’t, so keep going!! You’re “learning” to do new things, which take practice; not just doing them, like you’ve known how all your life.

It’s almost time for stories and steps - but first, let’s celebrate a few WINS. Perhaps you’ve stayed accountable and achieved a 30-day goal; awesome! Or maybe you’ve decided to go back to school and complete your degree in your mid-40s or 50s; fantastic! Or maybe you made a difficult decision that you’ve been postponing for months; congratulations. Or you just woke up today and celebrated that you are you; fabulous! Celebrating a WIN today, even if it’s been a really tough day, let’s you acknowledge that at least something is good about today and that’s important, even in the worst of times. You are a precious child of the universe; and are called a “human being” not a “human doing” for good reason. You don’t have to earn your value by what you do; you were born with it. You’re value comes from “who” you are; not what you do. Got it? I hope so because you’re going to keep hearing me say it, because it’s so important to your self-esteem and quality of life.

Let’s transition now to understanding more about ADHD therapy and ADHD coaching with relevant stories, action steps, and a favorite quote of mine.

How much time do we have? Not much. So let’s get to it.

Today’s 3 stories are focused on:

1. Later in life diagnosis of adult ADHD and what to do next

2. Adults learning essential executive function skills later in life

3. Embracing structure and cycles in all areas of your life

Now back to being an adult with ADHD in today’s world.

I’m going to share three stories with you today as well as talk about your responsibility in this (that’s right - response-ability or your ability to respond) – in this case to create the life for yourself that you’ve been trying to have. I hope at least one of these stories will resonate with you and be of benefit.

Shifting gears to our first story: Later in life diagnosis of adult ADHD and what to do next

· Molly was diagnosed in her 40s when her daughter went off to college and started to have very similar challenges as Molly had when she was in college. She daughter contacted the special student services and requested an assessment and was directed to the proper resources for that. As a result of her daughter’s assessment, Molly felt motivated to get her own assessment and see if ADHD could possibly be what had made her life so difficult for all these years.

· Both Molly and her daughter, Laura, received a diagnosis of ADHD, combined type. This means that they were both inattentive and hyperactive/impulsive. Important to note that the hyperactivity or impulsivity looks very different in females and older adults than it does in kids. It was Molly and Laura’s minds that were hyperactive, not so much their bodies.

· At Laura’s college they had special services to help her with her academic life which included planning her study time, following through on assignments and focus strategies while she attended classes. But what about Molly? She wasn’t in a structured place where all of this was available to her. And she hadn’t been given much structure or direction from the professional who assessed and diagnosed her of where she could find the similar kind of support that Laura was going to get. She was overwhelmed and confused.

· Molly remembered how when she was in a more structured system such a college, she functioned better. She looked around to see what kinds of systems were available to someone her age. She found some support groups for adults with ADHD and decided to start with that. At least she could meet other adults living with ADHD and find out what they were doing to function better.

Background facts:

· Receiving a diagnosis of adult ADHD later in life can be a mixed experience. Some adults of overwhelmed by the information or angry that it wasn’t diagnosed earlier in their life or resistant to the diagnosis as being accurate, perhaps because they had a belief that ADHD is a kids condition and doesn’t continue into adulthood. That couldn’t be farther from the truth.

· What might have made things easier for Molly when she received her diagnosis would have been to receive a document entitled “What Next?” This would have outlined her options such as therapy, medication, coaching, nutritional counseling, organizers and more.

· It also could have included information indicating the differences in manifestation of ADHD symptoms in males and females so she could have more easily accepted that as a female, her symptoms were classic. However, there is more press on presenting symptoms of males than females.

· Lastly, the document could have included information on resources for grieving the losses of her earlier years due to her undiagnosed ADHD. This might have allowed Molly to move forward more easily and with less pain, shame or regret.

If you relate to Molly’s story, your action steps are:

· Focus – on learning more about what the presenting symptoms of ADHD are in females not males and how these can be confused with other companion conditions and covered up by intelligence and socialization factors specific to females. Be sure to focus on what whether there are emotional issues you need to heal or skills that you need to build so you can function more effectively in your life.

· Follow Through – on asking for recommendations and referrals or a written out pathway from your diagnostician. Have them outline the next steps for you and where you go to inquire about these resources to help you, both ADHD coaching and therapy, depending on your needs.

· Self-Management – resist the impulse to get down on yourself and tell yourself that you “should have known sooner” because if you could have, you would have. It might be a bit of an up and down emotional ride in the beginning and developing some emotional self-regulation skills is definitely in order to ease your distress, which is part of ADHD coaching.

Transitioning to our second story: Adults learning essential executive function skills later in life

· Reggie didn’t believe for a moment that he could learn everything he needed to learn as an adult and raise his quality of life to where he could feel proud of himself. He suffered from tremendous shame and figured it was just too late for him since he was already in his 50s.

· And, there was the challenge of finding a place where adults like him studied these essential executive function skills and didn’t feel more embarrassed about their shortcomings. He just didn’t know if he had the stomach for being with others, even with they were like him, because it forced him to see the truth about his life and it was too much for him.

· However, his friend Charley sought him out, since they had similar backgrounds, and confided that he had recently started in an online program where he was learning all the executive function skills that he hadn’t learned as a kid or teen. He told Reggie that it felt awkward in the beginning and he didn’t feel right talking about what he didn’t know how to do. And what was worse, he didn’t feel comfortable sharing what his strengths and talents were either. He came to realize that he was hiding pretty much everything about himself due to shame.

· Reggie could really identify with Charley because he felt the same. He knew intellectually that he had strengths and talents that others didn’t possess, however, they didn’t seem like a big deal when he thought of all the things that he was lacking.

Background facts:

· We are only as sick as our secrets and the more we hide the truth about where we are in our lives, the worse it is for us. We need to find a safe space to be real and share our truth.

· Having a safe community of like-minded people to lean into can be exactly what you need to begin to open up and flourish. Sometimes it’s easier for a person to open up in a safe group environment than it is in a one-to-one situation; everyone is different.

· Remember that ADHD coaching is a wellness and strengths-based model where you aren’t viewed as broken or in need of fixing; rather your strengths and talents are highlighted and used to leverage your growth and development in weaker areas.

· As Jim Rohn said so eloquently, “For things to change, you’ve got to change.” As to what those changes need to be, it’s different for each of us. You might have escaped the psychological wounds and just need the skill development to build up your self-esteem and sense of self by identifying your strengths. Remember – competence leads to confidence.

If you relate to Reggie’s story, your action steps are:

· Focus – find a safe space where you can have your strengths and talents reflected back to you and leveraged for your personal growth

· Follow Through – on making sure that your needs are getting met whether that means some short-term therapy in conjunction with some ADHD coaching to build up your overall life skills and the specific executive function skills that weaken your performance in life

· Self-Management – the thoughts or feelings that you are all alone in your suffering and that no one would understand your journey. There are millions of adults who have had a similar journey to yours and developing the ability to share yourself more openly is the beginning of being able to manage yourself more effectively

Transitioning to our third story: Embracing structure and cycles in all areas of your life

· Paula thought back to her years in college where the structure and cycles of academia were very clearly laid out. She knew exactly what was due and when; the expectations were clear.

· When she graduated college and landed her first corporate job she was in her late 20s and she thought it was going to be a really good fit for her because she would be part of a team, the work would be fast-paced and the people she would work with would be as driven and motivated as she was. She had no idea that she would become the weak link in the chain on her team.

· Paula had no idea about her undiagnosed ADHD or executive function challenges. The corporation she worked for had an in-house coach to keep the higher-level team players at their optimal. In one of the coaching sessions the corporate coach took Paula aside and asked if she had ever been assessed for adult ADHD. Paula was shocked and a bit put off. She had done so well until now, how could that possibly be true and what was the corporate coach basing this statement on?

· The coach proceeded to explain to her that they were neither an ADHD coach nor an expert in the field, however, one of his siblings had adult ADHD and executive function challenges they had been severely impacted by this until they got specialized ADHD coaching.

· Paula was “all ears” since she was now in her early 30’s and was already tired of her corporate position because it was just too hard to keep up with the rest of the team. She couldn’t even imagine working this way for another year, and she felt awful. So she asked the corporate coach for direction on how to find someone for ADHD coaching.

Background Facts:

· We are the meaning makers of our lives. We spin stories and give reasons for why things are happening the best we can, especially when we don’t know the whole story.

· Are you like so many others in the work force where you’ve already decided that you aren’t cut out for the work you felt would be perfect for you? And have you kind of given up on your dreams of success in your chosen field?

· The power of coaching and specifically ADHD coaching is to help you see yourself in your life and see where your strategies and ways of approaching tasks, projects and life in general is misguided. It’s not personal; it’s your systems and strategies that are off.

· It’s so important that the meaning we give things empowers us to get into action rather than straps us down into a frozen state. Believing that your career of choice is over before you’ve even gotten started with it is definitely not empowering; it’s a self-defeating belief.

If you relate to Paula’s story, your action steps are:

o Focus – on being proactive in your life and asking a better question like “HOW will this get done?” rather than assuming it can’t. Focus on the options of how.

o Follow Through – on making decisions by yourself or with the help of others you trust that are well thought out rather than impulsive or reactive to a situation you feel is hopeless.

o Self-Management – of your thoughts and feelings about what is possible for you. Be sure to keep yourself away from predicting your future based on your past. That’s not empowering. Hang out with people who believe in you, support you and help yourself to regulate your feelings by tapping into the strength or certainty of others when you feel uncertain. Borrow someone else’s hope when yours is running low. This is also a benefit of ADHD coaching because your coach isn’t living your experience even though they are in it with you to help move you forward by showing you optional ways of thinking about the circumstances of your life.

A Favorite Quote:

Nelson Mandela said, "A winner is a dreamer who never gives up.” The question I have for you at this point of our journey together is, do you have a dream that you’ve given up on because you didn’t know there was ADHD coaching and executive function skill training to raise the level of your skills and improve the quality of your life so that achieving your dream becomes a reality?

Whether you’re learning from my podcast episodes or live videos or working with me directly, you are in my world and I’m here to serve your needs. So be sure to reach out and get your needs met. It’s up to you to take action here so things can change for you.

In the show notes you will find information about my upcoming free webinar this Sunday, November 17, 2019 at 5 pm PT. The topic is Three Steps to Start Getting Organized – The Fun Way. I hope you’ll come prepared to have some fun together as we enter the world of getting organized without overwhelm or frustration.

So, if you’re feeling overwhelmed and lack the steps and skills to get started with your organizational adventures, be sure to register and let’s have some fun together. You’ll have the opportunity to share your challenges with me when you register as well as what you are seeking as solutions. I look forward to being together and knowing what would be most helpful to you.

I appreciate you showing up to listen today and in the future. I’m making my way back to producing regular episodes. And as a subscriber, the newest episode will automatically be in your feed.

If you enjoyed today’s episode or any of the other episodes, please share this podcast show with your friends and family, as well as rate the show. If you’d like to do a little more, write a thoughtful review on iTunes so I know I’m meeting your needs. It doesn’t have to be anything lengthy; just a line or two of how the podcast is helping you, if it is. I love hearing from you. It means a lot to me to know your life is getting a little bit better every time we get together.

Be sure to check out the show notes for more free content and ways we can work together. You’ll find the link to the “elephant” resource I talked about earlier in this episode with the questions to ask a therapist, the link to register for the upcoming free webinar this Sunday, and a new free resource to help you live a clutter-free life. I have solutions to the challenges you are experiencing because I lived with those challenges, made my way out, and would like to help you get out too.

I hope to see you this Sunday, November 17, 2019 at 5 pm PT, and read ahead of time what your challenges are and what you need, that is…if that’s of interest to you. Thanks for listening… Until the next time… Bye for now…



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